tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post8725219345661289060..comments2024-03-28T13:08:04.959-07:00Comments on CONTRARY BRIN: The Difference Between Science Fiction and Fantasy?David Brinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comBlogger149125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-81747337641291984442017-03-13T22:07:02.476-07:002017-03-13T22:07:02.476-07:00As the comment right above mine (as I type) puts i...As the comment right above mine (as I type) puts it, an interesting argument. I've only just read it, briefly, once, so I'm not sure whether I agree with it, but I do feel compelled to pipe in with a quibble.<br /><br />I think pointing to Tolkien and calling <i>The Lord of the Rings</i> fantasy is, by your own standards, an error. The book's over-arching theme (or one of them) was about nothing <i>but</i> change, of an old order giving way to a new. Granted that Tolkien probably saw that change as a decline, not an improvement, but his was not a static vision.<br /><br />And of course there was that fantastic world-building, which is why I also wanted to define it as SF, not fantasy. But that's my own buggaboo ...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-9587348708214824752017-03-13T12:31:06.742-07:002017-03-13T12:31:06.742-07:00It's an interesting argument, but ultimately a...It's an interesting argument, but ultimately a useless one. If you define SF and F by your own idiosyncratic definition, you create nothing but confusion. <br /><br />A definition of Science Fiction *MUST* include all the works that are generally considered classics and foundational works of the genre, AND all the works that the *general public* will immediately recognize when you say the name. Your definition would do neither. It's just another variant of the guy who tries to say that "science fiction" means "stuff based on real science that we know" -- in other words, what HE means when he says "science fiction" is what other people call "ultra-hard SF". <br /><br />If your definition of Science Fiction doesn't include Foundation (which is all about Preserving the Old Order And Minimizing the Disruption Before We Get Back To It) or Star Wars (which plotwise is very like a classic Fantasy novel) it's failed at the most basic level: being useful in conversation with most people. <br /><br />In actuality, of course, any definition that's so hard-edged as to try to divide Science Fiction and Fantasy will fail, because they don't divide that easily. There's ultra-hard SF way over here on one side, and Lord of the Rings style fantasy off on the other (along with Oz, etc.), but a whole hell of a lot of stuff lies across the spectrum between.<br />Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)https://www.blogger.com/profile/14262994729427842484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-45694680217911432592017-03-11T23:13:13.525-08:002017-03-11T23:13:13.525-08:00First time poster here...I don't know that I a...First time poster here...I don't know that I agree with all of the limitations applied to fantasy, science fiction, etc. They can cross over and you can even see hybrids as a result.<br /><br />Herbert's novel isn't just about humanity rejecting the singularity but also about humanity's obsession with a messiah and how the message becomes so perverted that it u der mines the very essence of society. <br /><br />The anti-technology aspect of the Dune books is directly related to the reactionary aspect of humanity against technology that escapes their understanding and the vast intelligent artificial intelligence that attempts to control humanity. The irony, of course, is that both aspects (the messiah and the artificial intelligence) end up damaging society. We, as a culture, are always looking for deliverance because it's easier than taking the reins of our future and controlling our own destiny. In Herbert's worlds we see the extremes humanity and there's a lack of balance.Wayne Kleinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-43017111860313106802016-05-24T17:18:44.681-07:002016-05-24T17:18:44.681-07:00No. Stop.No. Stop.No.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-6570202422691696042014-06-13T05:15:18.356-07:002014-06-13T05:15:18.356-07:00A lot of sci-fi fans don't believe in mystical...<br />A lot of sci-fi fans don't believe in mystical concepts like 'fate'. If they did, they'd be reading fantasy.<br />'Defying fate' is an oxymoron. Fate, if it means anything at all, means that it's unchangeable. If you can change it, it's not fate. It's just probability and you 'defy' that every time you throw two heads in a row. Doesn't sound quite so dramatic though, does it? Totally That Guy! - Glasgow Web Developmenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08845520815523596667noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-44365983377770197872012-06-13T20:29:23.981-07:002012-06-13T20:29:23.981-07:00I just recently heard China Mieville on "Geek...I just recently heard China Mieville on "Geek's Guide to the Galaxy," and he stated that he believes that there actually *is no* difference between science fiction and fantasy. I would love to see Brin and Mieville discuss the top. Not *fight*; I'm genuinely interested in how they would discuss the topic!Douglas Moranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16065006638857432850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-70386090863669945242012-01-15T18:40:25.127-08:002012-01-15T18:40:25.127-08:00This kind of distinction makes me think about L.E....This kind of distinction makes me think about L.E. Modesitt's Spellsong Cycle. It's sword-and-sorcery fantasy, but the main character/sorceress is actually a middle-aged music teacher who gets transported to another world. A large part of the book is her struggle to change the social order there. She insists on educating the children of nobles, and using her spells to build networks of roads, and mine gold.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08709889306652406512noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-86295331445727333232011-04-18T04:40:30.705-07:002011-04-18T04:40:30.705-07:00I certainly saw 20 or so WW1 re-enactors in Englan...I certainly saw 20 or so WW1 re-enactors in England at a multi-period event about 7 years ago now. Their display consisted to a large extent of sitting about for ages, then going over the top and getting massacred by a machine gun.<br /><br />The WW2 people had tanks and armoured cars and a spitfire flypast.guthriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17992984293423290387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-38615591329818938942011-04-14T23:03:16.589-07:002011-04-14T23:03:16.589-07:00Anonymous,
Yes, my variant of Jacob's idea wou...Anonymous,<br />Yes, my variant of Jacob's idea would allow bullying. Worse than you think, it's just "Give me your voter-card or you'll be sacked." (It'll be subtler than that, psychopaths are generally quite good at this stuff.)Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-61692908096841109112011-04-14T22:57:49.182-07:002011-04-14T22:57:49.182-07:00Jacob,
"In my system, authorities wouldn'...Jacob,<br /><i>"In my system, authorities wouldn't have access. The computers would be kept [...]"</i><br /><br />Kept by whom? This is the main problem I have with your system. The people who bring in the system, are the people who set the terms of access, and are the people who control the machines.<br /><br />There are lots of proposed systems of government or elections, which I think would work better than democracy/etc, except they require absolute honesty by the people who create and run the system.Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-86608864513727712032011-04-14T13:13:50.552-07:002011-04-14T13:13:50.552-07:00@Robert said... And even better, if you record you...<i>@Robert said... And even better, if you record your employer doing that, you can be put in jail for illegally recording him or her, while his blatantly illegal actions get a pass because his rights were violated."</i><br />It's not clear that you committed any crime (especially if you are forethoughtful enough to be wearing a wire for your local prosecutor), and it is clear that the employer did.<br /><br />You're still at the mercy of the local prosecutor, who is often elected.rewinnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14008105385364113371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-25835461111934432062011-04-14T12:30:04.706-07:002011-04-14T12:30:04.706-07:00onwardonwardDavid Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-46637952728821121662011-04-14T11:26:13.643-07:002011-04-14T11:26:13.643-07:00And even better, if you record your employer doing...And even better, if you record your employer doing that, you can be put in jail for illegally recording him or her, while his blatantly illegal actions get a pass because his rights were violated.<br /><br />Rob H.Acacia H.https://www.blogger.com/profile/07678539067303911329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-63099909854393007072011-04-14T10:52:29.378-07:002011-04-14T10:52:29.378-07:00Absentee ballots are the worst thing for employees...Absentee ballots are the worst thing for employees with overbearing employers. The boss can order you to bring in an absentee ballot, mark it for you, and order you to sign the flap; then the boss takes the ballot from you and mails it to assure that his candidate/proposition gets your vote.<br /><br />Or you can try to find another job in this economy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-23304716604232227172011-04-14T10:43:25.531-07:002011-04-14T10:43:25.531-07:00Is the suggestion that an individual can choose to...Is the suggestion that an individual can choose to vote openly or secretly? <br /><br />Scenario: Vote for Joe Schmo or you'll be laid off. Vote openly and your boss gives you a raise. Vote secretly and your boss assumes you voted for Jim Schwim and you're out looking for a job.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-28535077549684190002011-04-14T09:29:41.166-07:002011-04-14T09:29:41.166-07:00The Difference Between Science Fiction and Fantasy...<i><br />The Difference Between Science Fiction and Fantasy?"<br /></i><br /><br />Democratic budgets are science fiction.<br /><br />Republican budgets are fantasy.<br /><br />As comic-book writer/author Dave Sim would say, "Like any good story, it explains a lot."LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-27136051721320569322011-04-14T08:59:02.588-07:002011-04-14T08:59:02.588-07:00Hi Paul,
Yes, I think it would. I'd require ...Hi Paul,<br /><br />Yes, I think it would. I'd require people to pick up the card in person to reduce the security risk of cards being misused.<br /><br />In my system, authorities wouldn't have access. The computers would be kept cold and stored away. Fraud investigations would only be able to access under secrutiny of both parties + observers a subset of the list that was relative to whatever they were investigating. <br /><br />But that doesn't mean an alternative such as the one you suggest might not make people more comfortable.Jacobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03773076186367856200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-55128413057764913152011-04-14T06:51:45.414-07:002011-04-14T06:51:45.414-07:00Best Show'n'tell Ever!
Youtube from BadAs...Best Show'n'tell Ever!<br /><br /><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=HFf3ZWNF6EY" rel="nofollow">Youtube</a> from BadAstronomy.Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-53806876932700340992011-04-14T06:40:28.305-07:002011-04-14T06:40:28.305-07:00(3rd attempt)
Broccoli helps cure lung infection....(3rd attempt)<br /><br />Broccoli helps cure lung infection.<br /><br />Symbolic magic?<br /><br /><a href="http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20378-broccoli-helps-clear-damaged-lungs.html" rel="nofollow">NewScientist</a><br /><br />(sersl: Blogger is sersl giving me the shits.)Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-21853464112903421152011-04-14T06:11:25.632-07:002011-04-14T06:11:25.632-07:00Dr Brin:
China bans time travel.
So everybody has...Dr Brin:<br /><i>China bans time travel.</i><br /><br />So everybody has to stop moving forward at one second per second?LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-16720601385709571662011-04-14T06:09:58.173-07:002011-04-14T06:09:58.173-07:00Tony Fisk:
"We can't tax the very people...Tony Fisk:<br /><i><br />"We can't tax the very people that we expect to reinvest in our economy," Mr Boehner said.<br /><br />Indeed not, but who would these people be? The rich don't make money, they collect it.<br /></i><br /><br />More to the point, they don't invest it in productivity any more.<br /><br />It might well have been true 90 years ago that "What's good for General Motors is good for the USA". The same is NOT the case for Haliburton or NewsCorp.LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-14364653109171721482011-04-14T04:51:20.223-07:002011-04-14T04:51:20.223-07:00(part three...)
"concerned about vigilantes....(part three...)<br /><br /><i>"concerned about vigilantes. [...] Information has to be distributed without alerting the authorities."</i><br /><br />Dude, it's the authorities I'm worried about.<br /><br />(enspig: Short pig. As distinct from emspig.)Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-54913121664405401082011-04-14T04:50:09.623-07:002011-04-14T04:50:09.623-07:00(Part two...)
If you only vote in person, they ch...(Part two...)<br /><br />If you only vote in person, they check your voter card is unused. If you decide to vote in person <i>after</i> voting online, you can ask the Electoral Official to delete your e-vote.<br /><br />Jacob, does that meet your needs? You remain anonymous unless you put your hand up and say "this is me". Also, you only need to lock the e-vote record on the polling day.Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-55423740633387059902011-04-14T04:48:54.114-07:002011-04-14T04:48:54.114-07:00(Blogger's being a bitch... part one...)
Jaco...(Blogger's being a bitch... part one...)<br /><br />Jacob, <br />You don't actually need to link the voter-number to the voter's name. If every registered voter is sent a card with a randomly generated key and no record is kept of what card was sent to what voter. Vote online with the key. (Then add a password. Key+password lets you verify or change your vote.)<br /><br />(rewismis: Acronym for "What You See Is Not What You Get".)Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-17037654603582157582011-04-14T04:47:19.623-07:002011-04-14T04:47:19.623-07:00The gerontocracy feared an encroachment on their t...The gerontocracy feared an encroachment on their turf.Tim H.noreply@blogger.com