tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post7060937154831856807..comments2024-03-29T06:22:47.638-07:00Comments on CONTRARY BRIN: Ways to Corner John Roberts... and why 'cornering' doesn't interest the paladins on our own sideDavid Brinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comBlogger83125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-57477624624196913192022-07-15T19:22:40.008-07:002022-07-15T19:22:40.008-07:00onward
onward
onward<br />onward<br />David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-35790332305320729922022-07-15T13:50:31.859-07:002022-07-15T13:50:31.859-07:00Der Oger might find these responses from Germans a...<i>Der Oger might find these responses from Germans about Germany's court system interesting. There's too much to quote the whole thing, but no paywall.</i><br /><br />Thank you!<br /><br />Sorry for my late answer, have been busy this week. Some thoughts and additions:<br /><br />- Technically, in the EU, the national courts are lower in hierarchy than the EU Court. I believe there are one or two cases when our courts have been overruled by the EU Courts.<br />- While the abortion rights decisions are now in focus of public interest, there have been a number of rulings that ultimately helped to form the society we live in today. Examples would be the Lüth decision (wherein Lüth, a public official, was considered within the regulations for free speech when he publicly condemned a film director employed by the Nazis after the war and demanded him to be cancelled), Brokdorf (putting limits on the state on how they can deal with public protests and even riots) and the Air Security Law (which was introduced after 9/11, and would have allowed the state to shoot down passenger vehicles that would have been abducted by terrorists but got vetoed by the court).<br />- Theoretically at least, judges are under the same restrictions than other public servants to refrain from unconstitutional activities; doing so could lead to removal from office. In reality, the hurdles are quite high, and I believe neither of the Trump candidates would have "qualified" as "politically unreliable". They just won't have gotten the necessary votes, at least not, if not candidates from the other side of the aisle would not also have gotten a seat, too.<br />Der Ogerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00977602334642769985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-60091283879318132152022-07-14T18:09:03.787-07:002022-07-14T18:09:03.787-07:00I saw that. An excellent idea :-)I saw that. An excellent idea :-)Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04909011338723657265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-18129860430906994452022-07-14T17:30:49.914-07:002022-07-14T17:30:49.914-07:00Ok, I'll send this Texas woman the money to pa...Ok, I'll send this Texas woman the money to pay a fine if she <b>loses</b> the case, therefore setting precedent that a fetus isn't a person...<br /><br />https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/11/us/pregnant-woman-hov-lane/index.html<br /><i><br />Brandy Bottone was driving in the HOV lane meant for at least two people per vehicle in Dallas, Texas, two weeks ago when she was pulled over by police. The officer noted there didn’t seem to be anyone else in the car, but Bottone had a retort – she was 34 weeks pregnant.<br /><br />“He said, ‘Is there somebody else in the car?’ And, looking around, I said, ‘Yes there is,’ and he said ‘Well, where?’ I pointed at my stomach and I was like, ‘Right here,’” she told CNN on Sunday.<br /><br />“He said, ‘Well, it’s two bodies outside of the body, so that doesn’t count.’ I was kind of in shock, and I was like, ‘Well, in light of everything that’s happened, and I’m not trying to make a huge political stance here, but do you understand that this is a baby?’”<br /><br />The interaction, first reported by The Dallas Morning News, came days after the US Supreme Court ruled there is no federal right to abortion and declared abortion rights can be determined by each state. Texas, like other states led by conservative officials, has pushed to restrict abortion and has defined a fetus or unborn baby as a “person” in its penal code.<br />...<br /></i>Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-5862253335491257122022-07-13T18:01:53.034-07:002022-07-13T18:01:53.034-07:00This could be me...
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/0...This could be me...<br />https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/04/opinion/these-truths-we-holdand-share.html<br /><i><br />...<br />Our founders bequeathed to us something radical, something unprecedented: the tools with which to build a multiracial, multiethnic, pluralist democracy that extends the privilege of American identity to all.<br /><br />My love of America — of the American idea — is unwavering. This laboratory of liberty is worth saving, worth improving.<br /><br />But I fear we are mired in a culture of absolutism and tearing ourselves apart at the seams.<br />...<br /></i><br /><br />Then the inevitable bothsiderism, right?<br /><i><br />...<br />Everything right now, it seems, is black or white, all or nothing, perfect or unacceptable. Every venue has become a theater for performatively asserting our own virtue or righteousness, or for denying someone else’s. The so-called microaggressions keep getting smaller, the disproportionate penalties bigger. Nuance and complexity, let alone compromise, are nowhere to be found. In their place is a pervasive, paralyzing cynicism. And in turn, our extreme challenges remain extremely unsolved.<br /><br />Even among those with whom we largely agree, we’ve normalized intolerance and incivility. Among those with whom we disagree, we shame and cancel. We dehumanize and demonize.<br />...<br /></i><br /><br />Not quite. it's about time this was said explicitly.<br /><i><br />...<br />Certainly, not everyone is equally culpable or complicit. To suggest that the people and groups denigrating human rights and human dignity are somehow on equal footing with those of us defending them is wrong. This would imply a false moral equivalence.<br /><br />And make no mistake about my own view: The advocacy of those working to reimagine our society is of a different category from — asymmetrical to — the backlash of those rolling back our rights and fighting to restore an unequal past. The former is challenging us to be better, more inclusive, more equitable. The latter too often is daring us to be worse.<br />...<br /></i><br />Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-65171644316815227812022-07-13T15:30:52.768-07:002022-07-13T15:30:52.768-07:00Regarding trolls, I like the way MCToon "deb...Regarding trolls, I like the way MCToon "debates" flatearthers. Relentless, calm, well-searched, and constantly pushing to stay on subject.Don Gisselbeckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05770961482198971383noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-46358445549818048772022-07-13T12:38:27.572-07:002022-07-13T12:38:27.572-07:00So in the interest of not discussing trolls (I typ...So in the interest of not discussing trolls (I typo'd that as drools once and liked it)... <br /><br />(*) Do the paladins at least agree on who is a paladin?<br /><br />I ask because a get-together would at minimum support a place to discuss which strategies they are actually using.<br /><br /><br />I think of paladins a bit like t-cells. They point to dangers and occasionally that's enough. Robust foes require the rest of the immune system to activate, though, and cause specialist cells to arrive on the scene. Some work in acidic environments. Some in basic ones. Other's flood the area and drown the attacker in so much fluid that they are flushed out. (Achoo!)<br /><br />So for any paladins here... who are the specialists who back you up when your frontal assault is rebuffed? Who saps the castle walls? Who designs your siege engines from local materials? Who maps the countryside to describe what an effective siege must do? <br />Alfred Differhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01170159981105973192noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-23825454472388363682022-07-13T12:24:23.544-07:002022-07-13T12:24:23.544-07:00Tony hi! I got a message about that pwiki account...Tony hi! I got a message about that pwiki account. Are you still maintaining it?<br /><br />Locum serves a function. I can clearly and openly calibrate my troll tolerance standards. He deliberately skates several cliff-edges and gets banned for months when he goes over them. A couple of stupider trolls gleefully yowled venom and hateful fecal-hurls and were trivial to get rid of.David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-27310705720067928462022-07-13T08:20:18.906-07:002022-07-13T08:20:18.906-07:00@Paradoctor,
I'm not arguing cross purposes w...@Paradoctor,<br /><br />I'm not arguing cross purposes with you. But "ruining the forum" is when it becomes all about discussing the troll.Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-6906084656512342222022-07-13T08:08:32.512-07:002022-07-13T08:08:32.512-07:00Larry Hart:
You can humiliate a troll without ruin...Larry Hart:<br />You can humiliate a troll without ruining the forum if your stinging rebuke is polite, accurate, sharp, well-reasoned, and well-spoken. Speaking about them in the third person removes the attention factor. If they choose to object to the rebuke, then they must identify themselves as its target, and thus accuse themselves.Paradoctorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04821968120388981470noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-80608579367257095772022-07-13T05:39:16.930-07:002022-07-13T05:39:16.930-07:00Larry Hart,
re the German constitutional court. (I...Larry Hart,<br />re the German constitutional court. (I am not German but live in Germany so I am aware of it). I think a couple of things to remember here:<br />1. Germany has a proportional electoral system - governments are always coalitions and compromise is something they are used to seeking. I really think Americans greatly underestimate the poisonous effect the two-party system has. It not only encourages zero sum thinking, but it also makes corrupting the referees a winning strategy - multiple players want fair referees.<br />2. Yes, the German court doesn't just say yes or no, it makes suggestions at about what legislative approaches it would accept.reasonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09488435543492412991noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-5625803412688973242022-07-13T04:33:42.589-07:002022-07-13T04:33:42.589-07:00Paradoctor:
Perhaps what they [trolls] want is an...Paradoctor:<br /><i><br />Perhaps what they [trolls] want is an argument, but they do not try to win the argument, for that would require logic and evidence<br /></i><br /><br />Sealioning perhaps? Never conceding defeat, but just dragging the argument out point by irrelevant point, as if always advancing?<br /><br /><i><br />The proof is that they don't go away until they are humiliated. I propose that we give them what they want.<br /></i><br /><br />Kinda ruins the forum, though, which might be want they want.<br /><br />Tony Fisk:<br /><i><br />My theory is that he fancies himself as a contrarian: n. a person who opposes or rejects popular opinion, especially in stock exchange dealings. (OED)<br /></i><br /><br />That would certainly apply to Canadian comics writer/artist Dave Sim, and loc echoes Dave in many ways, including British spelling.<br /><br />Alfred Differ:<br /><i><br />My theory is this particular one likes our host's attention. 8)<br /></i><br /><br />If I had a gun to my head to pick one, that would be it.Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-77526398708878307142022-07-13T04:31:21.853-07:002022-07-13T04:31:21.853-07:00Trolls are needy, but what do they want?
Attentio...<i> Trolls are needy, but what do they want?</i><br /><br />Attention. The worst thing you can do to a troll is deprive them of attention.<br /><br />Positive or negative, it shows people care about them.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04909011338723657265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-10797704900993973422022-07-13T03:04:47.510-07:002022-07-13T03:04:47.510-07:00My theory is that he fancies himself as a contrari...My theory is that he fancies himself as a contrarian: <i>n. a person who opposes or rejects popular opinion, especially in stock exchange dealings. (OED)</i><br /><br />In the context of this group, I suppose that's so, in a pythonesque way.Tony Fiskhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14578160528746657971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-12498343159231425932022-07-12T23:52:37.493-07:002022-07-12T23:52:37.493-07:00My theory is this particular one likes our host...My theory is this particular one likes our host's attention. 8)Alfred Differhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01170159981105973192noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-12480336174292163902022-07-12T22:31:25.067-07:002022-07-12T22:31:25.067-07:00Trolls are needy, but what do they want? Not valid...Trolls are needy, but what do they want? Not validation, for they go where they do not like and say what will never be agreed to. Nor do they seek information. Perhaps what they want is an argument, but they do not try to win the argument, for that would require logic and evidence. My theory is that they seek loss and humiliation. It's an S&M thing. The proof is that they don't go away until they are humiliated. I propose that we give them what they want. Paradoctorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04821968120388981470noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-14450234419785660952022-07-12T14:51:04.791-07:002022-07-12T14:51:04.791-07:00What to do about trolls? Two blogs that I frequent...What to do about trolls? Two blogs that I frequent have different responses. <br /><br />The comments section attached to "Sinfest" is well-censored. If you differ from Tatsumi Ishida's defensive fringe outrage, then you are banned. As a result his comments section is moribund. Censorship is a guarantor of mental decay: CIAGOMD. His strip is worn out, having run out of jokes years ago. He can still draw, but it's all drivel. I keep looking because it's a train-wreck, and also to keep a wary eye out for the latest damfoolery. <br /><br />This is in dramatic contrast to the "Field Negro" comments section. Its host lets everyone comment. As a result there are regular thoughtful commentators, but also there is a swarm of anonymous haters flooding the zone with excrement. I think Field does this to let white boys like me see for ourselves just what toxicity that honest Black folks must endure. <br /><br />I have learned there not to feed the trolls. You cannot reason them out of the vile libels that they did not come to by reason. But though there's no point in talking _to_ trolls, there is point, and pleasure, in talking _about_ them. Hone your analysis. Dissect their mental and moral defects. Seek unsympathetic understanding.<br /><br />Do not feed the trolls, but do eat them. Metaphorically. <br />Paradoctorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04821968120388981470noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-18663181474043573292022-07-12T13:46:55.081-07:002022-07-12T13:46:55.081-07:00Der Oger might find these responses from Germans a...Der Oger might find these responses from Germans about Germany's court system interesting. There's too much to quote the whole thing, but no paywall.<br /><br />https://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2022/Senate/Maps/Jul12.html#item-7<br /><i><br />...<br /><b>E.B. in Hanover, Germany:</b> While the German Federal Constitutional Court was modeled in no small part on the Supreme Court of the United States (in particular with its ability to strike down laws it deems unconstitutional) it has (in my view as a non-lawyer) more often than not propelled progress and has in particular tried to accommodate changed perceptions of the public. For example, quite recently it has interpreted into a pretty vague article in the Basic Law (our constitution) the obligation of the government to introduce legislation to (even more fully) combat climate change, based on the article's requirement to protect the "natural basis of life."<br /><br />When conservatives tried to block same-sex civil unions in 2001, the Court declared that because civil unions are not marriages, there is no problem. In 2017, when we introduced same-sex marriages, the Court did not see a problem with this either, most probably because perceptions in the public on what "marriage" means had begun to change. On the other hand, regarding abortion, while the Court has more or less stated that life begins with conception and thus stroke down an abortion law it felt had put too little weight on that approach, it basically pre-formulated a compromise which it would accept: Today, elective abortion is not actually lawful but no one involved will be prosecuted if certain (not trivial but arguably not too burdensome) conditions are fulfilled. This seems a good compromise, because nobody is positively happy with it, but it has basically settled the matter.<br /><br />The Court has a very high reputation, which may be connected to their judges (who retire after twelve years on the bench or reaching age 68) being elected by a two-thirds majority in either the Federal Diet or the Federal Council. So, to the extent there are hardliners or extremists among German jurists, they usually just don't manage to arrive at the Court.<br />...<br /></i>Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-22367122992166820752022-07-12T13:04:59.655-07:002022-07-12T13:04:59.655-07:00Larry,
Yah. His dictionary definition for blackma...Larry,<br /><br />Yah. His dictionary definition for blackmail is actually decent. Our host's version is an extension that shows what people with with knowledge of tradecraft can do when demanding ANOTHER BENEFIT. <br /><br />My primary concern is blackmail of politicians with access to state powers, so I think it's reasonable to focus on state actors who are VERY likely to have tradecraft experience. Do that, and it becomes clear why this has to be a counter-intelligence effort.Alfred Differhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01170159981105973192noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-30009713853459282922022-07-12T12:59:11.961-07:002022-07-12T12:59:11.961-07:00And, as minority status is said to confer 'dis...<i>And, as minority status is said to confer 'disadvantage' and 'disadvantage' is said to equal 'oppression', then it follows that the human subcategory 'white' equals a disadvantaged & oppressed human minority.<br /><br />These are YOUR terms & YOUR word usage...</i><br /><br />I have to say, locum, that that was a particularly dumb strawman, one that would make the Scarecrow in the <i>Wizard of Oz</i> bow in submission. :D<br /><br />It really takes willful blindness to say that the Left believes minority status automatically confers "disadvantage" and "oppression" when one of the leading Leftist organizations is "Other 98 Percent" and how they are being oppressed. Did you forget about them? Did you forget that the Left believes that the oligarchs, who are by definition a minority in any political entity, oppress everyone else? As do the tyrants and the fascists?<br /><br />When two seconds of thought brings up an obvious refutation of your point, you really need to start thinking about how you missed that in the first place. :)A.F. Reyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02160750209354337944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-51107281432708882202022-07-12T12:42:57.913-07:002022-07-12T12:42:57.913-07:00Alfred Differ:
Heh. My bingo card got a few marks...Alfred Differ:<br /><i><br />Heh. My bingo card got a few marks on it with that last one.<br /><br />Dictionary attack<br /></i><br /><br />"6 foot tall, 180 pound Rocko beats up all the little kids at the park every day. But since there are five of them and only one of him, he is the oppressed one. By definition. It's in the dictionary."<br /><br />Not to mention that the drawn out definition of blackmail which he provides proves everyone else's point, not his. That the purpose isn't to get the kid to stop wetting the bed, but to victimize the kid. So I won't mention it.Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-74335623019301636302022-07-12T12:34:49.483-07:002022-07-12T12:34:49.483-07:00Personally, don’t dislike you, anymore than I disl...Personally, don’t dislike you, anymore than I dislike Trump. Am not going to even write that you’re Wrong. But you provide scant evidence. The white complaint today is the same as that which I heard in the South long ago. Then, though, the Southern workers were a bit more content—because it was before unions were diminished.<br />The cracker plaint then was that ‘whites came from Europe and made something out of this continent’. Yes, with great assistance from slaves and ‘coolies’, plus countless others who lived worse off than we have. (So far.)<br />I don’t want you to cease blogging here, due to curiosity as to whether you have something to say that hasn’t been said since 1619. <br />You could write that Communist infiltration of progressive organizations confused laborers. You could write that not all unions have had a positive influence, and provide examples of such. You could write on how K-16 education might not be as good as it could (possibly) be. <br />You could accept it that rural denizens are no more moral than anyone else. This isn’t the 19th century when they saved every scrap of yarn; and during the 19th c. slaves helped them grow some of the fibers in the yarn. <br />Much more.<br />But instead you’re all over the road in your comments: you may be conflating scatter-brained thinking with being broad-minded. You are a medical professional? Well, you wouldn’t succeed as a sociology or poli-sci professor.Alan Brookshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17996922923136240709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-48993528893703263752022-07-12T12:16:33.064-07:002022-07-12T12:16:33.064-07:00Heh. My bingo card got a few marks on it with that...Heh. My bingo card got a few marks on it with that last one.<br /><br /><br />Dictionary attack<br /><br />Twisting Chain (no possible tangents)<br /><br />Absurd Conclusion: Premise denied instead of proof method<br /><br /><br />Oh. And the fallacy at the end that he wanted to reach by any means, but that's the free spot on the bingo card.<br /><br />Alan Brooks,<br /><br /><i>...because I don’t quite comprehend him.</i><br /><br />That's a big part of why our host tolerates him here. We get to see each other and try to make sense of it all. Bubble popping. [That's why I don't hold back on my opinions either. Exposure to diversity is annoying, but people who learn how to scratch that itch make better compromisers.]<br /><br />My personal opinion is locumranch is conditioned to expect negative feedback from previous years and experiences and he gets it here. Loads of it.<br /><br />Some of what he says makes some sense, though, if you start from a condition of learned helplessness. I don't recommend that. It's too easy to give up fighting for something good when you don't believe good is possible let alone reachable.Alfred Differhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01170159981105973192noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-74898739193611448132022-07-12T10:55:44.248-07:002022-07-12T10:55:44.248-07:00I'm clearly wearing out my welcome, so I will ...<br />I'm clearly wearing out my welcome, so I will take an extended break after leaving you with a brief question & few explanations:<br /><br /><i>So, Mr. Big Shot, do you think your friends would be so impressed with you if they knew that you were a chronic bedwetter until age 15 ? </i><br /><br />Note how the above question (1) references a shameful, humiliating or compromising behaviour, (2) contains an implied threat about the revelation of said behaviour, (3) emphasizes the potential negative consequences of such a revelation and (4) is designed to give the utterer power, influence or control over said perpetrator. This is the very definition of the term 'Blackmail'. <br /><br /><i>black·mail<br />/ˈblakˌmāl/<br />noun<br /><br />the action, often treated as a criminal offense, of demanding payment or ANOTHER BENEFIT from someone in return for not revealing compromising or damaging information about them.</i><br /><br />Note also that the caucasian race is a global minority which accounts for about 7% of the world's humans. This is a statistical fact. And, as minority status is said to confer 'disadvantage' and 'disadvantage' is said to equal 'oppression', then it follows that the human subcategory 'white' equals a disadvantaged & oppressed human minority. <br /><br />These are YOUR terms & YOUR word usage, people, so you're not entitled to be either shocked or dismayed when fellow humans use your language in such a way that places you at a linguistic disadvantage. <br /><br />Consider the purchase of a dictionary.<br /><br /><br />Bestlocumranchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06812045410916208141noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-91956760737461457612022-07-12T10:39:08.587-07:002022-07-12T10:39:08.587-07:00Alan Brooks continued:
One would have to ask ones...Alan Brooks continued:<br /><i><br />One would have to ask oneself: would one wish to be black? No. For starters, black women, as most women, don’t usually feel safe going out at night. So they have two strikes against them.<br /></i><br /><br />Dave Sim used to throw out there as a gotcha line against feminism that "No one wants to be a woman." Even back in the day, I used to throw out Ayn Rand as an example of someone who would have agreed with his positions on gender relations, and yet <b>loved</b> being a woman. I believe she said something like, "I can't imagine being a man, because I love men so much."<br /><br />These days, with so much emphasis on transgender women, I think Dave's assertion stands self-evidently refuted.Larry Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01058877428309776731noreply@blogger.com