tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post5729063711074433273..comments2024-03-29T00:39:31.629-07:00Comments on CONTRARY BRIN: Plausible Deniability: How we'll be attacked, unable to retaliateDavid Brinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comBlogger73125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-44196251592814461272017-11-02T20:49:24.310-07:002017-11-02T20:49:24.310-07:00onward
onward
onward<br /><br />onward<br />David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-77322280749194424222017-11-02T18:28:38.023-07:002017-11-02T18:28:38.023-07:00Locum misses the point, as always. I don’t call Pu...Locum misses the point, as always. I don’t call Putin evil. Where did I say that? He is a clever warrior for the destruction of our Great Experiment and a return to 6000 years of feudalism. He has created an alliance to bring us down and is quite open about it.<br /><br />Take this from Vladimir Putin’s address to the Russian Federal Assembly following the referendum on annexation of Crimea, 18 March, 2014: “The USA prefers to follow the rule of the strongest and not by the international law. They are convinced that they have been chosen and they are exceptional, that they are allowed to shape the destiny of the world, that it is only them that can be right. They act as they please. Here and there they use force against sovereign states, set up coalitions in accordance with the principle: who is not with us is against us.”<br /><br />From his perspective, Obama and HClinton were very aggressive, pushing western values of liberty, democracy, freedom, individualism etc, e.g. in stealing the Ukraine from the Russian Sphere. Hence his devotion to defeating her and putting in his own puppet.<br /><br />See this fascinating report from the U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency on the Russian military buildup, along with their open war aginst us via cyber and propaganda and sabotage.<br /><br />http://www.dia.mil/Portals/27/Documents/News/Military%20Power%20Publications/Russia%20Military%20Power%20Report%202017.pdf<br /><br />From that report:<br /><br />“Major themes of Russian propaganda include: The West’s liberal world order is bankrupt and should be replaced by a Eurasian neo-conservative post-liberal world order, which defends tradition, conservative values, and true liberty.”<br /><br />You can tell a lot by what your adversary says to make himself out to be the hero. According to the Putin Doctrine:<br /><br />“The West demonizes Russia, which is only trying to defend its interests and sovereignty and act as an indispensable nation in world affairs. The United States is determined to interfere with and overthrow sovereign governments around the world.”<br /><br />And yes! We should squint and see how they see themselves as heroes and the injured party! Except that:<br /><br />1) Their complaint is that we have interfered in their traditional right to repress others. Ukrainians, Estonians, Latvians, Lithuanians, Poles… <br /><br />2) Blatantly, the U.S. could have destroyed them at any point across 70 years, especially the last 20. We did not. It is clear they would not have been so restrained, were the role ever reversed.<br /><br />3) The system they want the world to return to was tried for 6000 years and utterly failed. David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-39258086472873657422017-11-02T18:27:55.985-07:002017-11-02T18:27:55.985-07:00LarryHart: "So what does the "should&quo...LarryHart: "So what does the "should" imply?"<br /><br />Watch where you buy your diamonds? I don't know - probably whatever one wishes to make of it, more likely whatever many make of it together. But at the very least, it would challenge the claim 'there are no absolutes.'<br /><br /><i>"Sure, but plenty of Republicans will also fight against democracy. "Should" don't enter into it."</i><br />'Should' always enters into it - drives it, defines it, organizes it and sustains its organization. When they fight, to the extent they win, it's often by mustering 'shoulds' better than their adversaries (alongside the claim, 'the other side is worse'). I don't particularly care for Koch/Murdoch 'shoulds' - but also don't pretend they do not exist.donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-9534047479273064272017-11-02T17:34:04.996-07:002017-11-02T17:34:04.996-07:00@donzelion,
I think the point being argued is, &q...@donzelion,<br /><br />I think the point being argued is, "So What?" Slavery is evil (or in the sense of the original argument, "People <b>should</b> not practice slavery."), but people <b>do</b> practice slavery. So what does the "should" imply? That you and others will fight against slavers? Sure, but plenty of Republicans will also fight against democracy. "Should" don't enter into it.<br /><br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-39427173942447155712017-11-02T17:15:44.890-07:002017-11-02T17:15:44.890-07:00Rather say that some things have such a high weigh...Rather say that some things have such a high weight compared to the alternatives that in any realistic scenario the proper choice is clear.Lloyd Flackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00832519369660328832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-61679538948316912422017-11-02T17:07:30.699-07:002017-11-02T17:07:30.699-07:00LarryHart: I suppose I'll insist on some mora...LarryHart: I suppose I'll insist on some moral absolutes: <br />slavery is evil.<br />genocide is evil.<br />oligarchy is ugly and ineffective compared to a much better civilization we've constructed.<br /><br />If Locum, or anyone else, cares to argue these absolutes do not hold, I'll gladly attack their arguments. I suspect I would not be alone in the undertaking. donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-14168359787376679552017-11-02T17:03:54.298-07:002017-11-02T17:03:54.298-07:00Locum: "Terms like 'should', 'oug...Locum: <i>"Terms like 'should', 'ought' and 'supposed to' confer little meaning beyond personal preference."</i><br />So YOU believe. Yet these terms are believed, by every party engaging in every transaction that made it possible for you to type those words and transmit them somewhere, to have some meaning. All those folks may be wrong or misled. But they built your world in part by reliance on such beliefs.<br /><br />re the judgment on Putin<br /><br />Putin is no Stalin, not even a Khomeini or a Bin Laden in terms of the vileness hierarchy. At his worst, for Russia (and Ukraine, Georgia, and other targets of his 'affections'), he embraces and empowers a series of well-connected oligarchs, enriches some, strips others, all part of an ancient means of doing business through power.<br /><br />Putin is less some super-genius arch villain seeking to destroy the civilization that conferred your toys - he's a mundane, fairly typical expression of powerbrokers operating behind the scenes to maintain their power and squelch alternatives.<br /><br /><i>"The more LIGHT the West shines on Putin, the greater his international influence & the stronger he seems to grow."</i><br />I disagree.<br /><br />In the pool of 'strongmen,' the Philippines is more at risk of falling into Chinese orbit than Russian, Turkey's Erdogan has no better leverage to play to obtain economic opportunity from the EU than to hint at looking elsewhere, Venezuela is hardly a raging bastion of terror...all are hiccups, so long as America by and large plays by the 'rules.' When American casino operators and other financiers change the rules for their own benefit, the strongmen prosper - and Putin's own territorial ambitions become considerably less expensive. But to the extent his aspirations are known, they are far more difficult to achieve - nobody will wittingly be seen to embrace him (save perhaps the occasional Assad or two - monster unloved by anyone decent).<br /><br /><i>"Methinks that there is no such as bad advertising"</i><br />You are allowed to think what you like. I pray things remain that way. Milo Yonscampolis gets paid to say otherwise. But while conservatives whine about being silenced, they hold majorities in every position of power throughout the country - if anyone silences them, it's other conservatives.donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-7623553680792581722017-11-02T16:48:41.578-07:002017-11-02T16:48:41.578-07:00Lloyd Flack:
Locum, claiming that there are moral...Lloyd Flack:<br /><i><br />Locum, claiming that there are moral absolutes is claiming that morality can be reduced to simple rules which allow you to make decisions that you can be certain are right or wrong. But that is not how it is in real life<br /></i><br /><br />It's a bit confusing, but loc is arguing that there are <b>no</b> moral absolutes. He thinks <b>we're</b> the ones insisting that there are.<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-34465398701171523382017-11-02T16:39:57.364-07:002017-11-02T16:39:57.364-07:00"Why, pray tell, does David believe Putin so ..."Why, pray tell, does David believe Putin so despicable?"<br /><br />I'm sure Brin can answer that for himself, but I despise the man and would delight in reading of his assassination because he is a vicious despot, one step removed from Robert Mugabe or some of the grotesques ruling former Soviet states. He doesn't hesitate to order the murder of dissidents, opponents, and reporters, and he has stolen some eight trillion dollars from his people. Further, he has done everything he can to destabilise the west, America in particular.Zepp Jamiesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16261339498383415026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-18322831496377415732017-11-02T16:24:02.950-07:002017-11-02T16:24:02.950-07:00Locum, claiming that there are moral absolutes is ...Locum, claiming that there are moral absolutes is claiming that morality can be reduced to simple rules which allow you to make decisions that you can be certain are right or wrong. But that is not how it is in real life. Often we have conflicting moral imperatives and have to make a judgement call about the weights that we give them. Often any decision that we make has a moral downside even if a minor one.<br />Should we base morality on reigious claims? Why should I believe them? If what God wants requires my belif then God knows what is required for me to believe and it isn't prophets and scriptures. Thus I conclude that God is uninterested in my obedience or praise. Not much of a basis for morality is it?<br />Lloyd Flackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00832519369660328832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-63881129566193257652017-11-02T16:19:03.436-07:002017-11-02T16:19:03.436-07:00Regarding "Hidden Wealth": A few well pl...Regarding "Hidden Wealth": A few well placed drone strikes would destroy billions in ill-gotten gains. Those who are hiding wealth there couldn't even complain about it because that would mean they'd have to admit they had something of value stored in those "Freeports."Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00570649649208424406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-46510822879166547592017-11-02T15:35:52.303-07:002017-11-02T15:35:52.303-07:00Locum, the House Troll, hath said:
"TCB then...Locum, the House Troll, hath said:<br /><br />"TCB then sums up the whole moral relativism issue very nicely when he dismisses old school religious (absolute) morality as "horse shit", arguing (as he does) that morality is innate, uninterested (as he is) as to the origins of religious morality, yet convinced (as most are) that his rather subjective moral belief system 'should', 'ought' and 'is supposed to' be universally applicable & enforceable upon all in an absolute moral fashion."<br /><br />OOOHHHHH TASTY! Aren't you a saucy bugger. You sure told me what I think!<br /><br />I am, in fact, interested in the origins of religious morality to the extent that it is such a major cultural force for both good and ill; however, I argue (as I do!) that this origin has its most distant roots in biology and what we nowadays call game theory. Social creatures enjoy powerful survival advantages when they can cooperate, and the cooperative behaviors (as well as the punish-the-uncooperative behaviors) of nonhuman social creatures maps onto much of what humans call 'morality'.<br /><br />As for my supposed conviction that my "rather subjective moral belief system 'should', 'ought' and 'is supposed to' be universally applicable & enforceable upon all in an absolute moral fashion", why, heck, I thought that was <i>your</i> game! You're the one who seems insistent that religious codes are the source of human morality. I merely think they are codifications, i.e. standardized frameworks made possible by language and writing, of what already existed in its essence in the human heart. If humans were as amoral as jellyfish or bacteria, would they have listened to Moses and other such men when they proposed codes? Hard to see how. If humans had no innate sense of good/bad pleasure/pain survival/death dichotomies, how could you possibly explain to them that the Mosaic Code was 'better' than not having a code? The concept would be alien to such a people.<br /><br />Be that as it may, every neurologically normal human (and chimp and wolf) <i>does</i> have some concept that some things are better than others, for both self and society. All these creatures take care of helpless babies instead of eating them at once. All these creatures feel bonds of affection and solidarity. All these creatures cooperate for survival, at least as much as they compete.<br /><br />But Man, that naked monkey who found ways to cooperate and survive even in outer space, only that creature thinks he needs gods to tell him what the chimps and wolves and even he himself knows already.TCBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08153506222271955110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-16141626535563733002017-11-02T15:22:53.609-07:002017-11-02T15:22:53.609-07:00Terms like 'should', 'ought' and &...<br />Terms like 'should', 'ought' and 'supposed to' confer little meaning beyond personal preference.<br /><br />But back to specifics: <br /><br />Why, pray tell, does David believe Putin so despicable? Is it his atheism? His egotism? His military training? His pro-surveillance stance? His intestinal fortitude? His computer savvy? His predilection for partial nudity? His rejection of moral absolutes? His affection for aerospace technology? His diminutive stature? His horsemanship? His moral relativism? Are the WEE little nations envious of his authoritarian wee-wee? <br /><br />It's quite a puzzle. The more LIGHT the West shines on Putin, the greater his international influence & the stronger he seems to grow. Methinks that there is no such as bad advertising and, if this is so, perhaps MSNBC, CNN & the liberal mainstream media should stop screaming 'Trump Trump Trump' 24/7.<br /><br /><br />Best<br />locumranchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-39778578518937406992017-11-02T11:31:35.635-07:002017-11-02T11:31:35.635-07:00Smurphs:
And, every five years or so, there is an...Smurphs:<br /><i><br />And, every five years or so, there is another Catholic priest pedophile scandal. Within weeks, the Archdiocese start threatening to close parochial schools.<br /></i><br /><br />Actually, wouldn't that solve the problem?<br /><br />/sarcasm<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-67021178794454287192017-11-02T11:00:06.143-07:002017-11-02T11:00:06.143-07:00Re: the repeal of the Estate Tax. The Republicans ...Re: the repeal of the Estate Tax. The Republicans may get it or they may not, but they win either way. Squirrel!<br /><br />Living near a major metro area (Philadelphia), I see this every few years. When the City needs to slash programs they always start with the Library and the Pools. Communities fight fiercely to get them back, but give away everything else. Need a stadium deal, threaten to close the Library. Need more pork barrel money for the Port Authority, threaten to close the summer recreation centers. (Chicago and New York are nothing compared the corruption of the Delaware River Port Authority. I know, I've lived in all three.) Squirrel!<br /><br />And, every five years or so, there is another Catholic priest pedophile scandal. Within weeks, the Archdiocese start threatening to close parochial schools. Squirrel!<br /><br />Works every time.<br /><br />Smurphsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-18365965057861651682017-11-02T10:42:45.336-07:002017-11-02T10:42:45.336-07:00Locum: I always find this discussion funny, becau...Locum: I always find this discussion funny, because those who raise parts of it tend to ignore the implications of what they say, but here goes:<br /><br /><i>"(1) We humans are what we are; <br />(2) We reason, interact & behave in the manner that we reason, interact & behave; and<br />(3) Terms like 'ought', 'should' & 'supposed' to are meaningless verbal irrationalities."</i><br /><br />Terms like 'ought,' 'should' & 'supposed to' are terms we humans (whether Pinkerian or otherwise) actually use. A lot. We humans, being creatures that habitually use terms that you describe as 'meaningless' - create and confer meaning for those terms, much as we do with any other terms that we actually use. Whether our natures be fixed, or constructed, or transitional, our behavior in so doing this easily observable.<br /><br />Lloyd has stumbled into a feisty group that frequently contests the meanings that are ascribed, and that looks broadly for evidence that the processes utilized in reaching those meanings is sound and offers alternative mechanisms (e.g., TCB's evidence from chimps, and Dr. Brin's own criticism). He's found a bunch of irredeemable contrarians and intelligent sci-fi fans...which may be precisely what he was looking for (in which case, he OUGHT to enjoy the give'n'take).donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-89176912844885051842017-11-02T10:33:16.380-07:002017-11-02T10:33:16.380-07:00Larry,
"but next time, Democrats aren't g...Larry,<br /><i>"but next time, Democrats aren't going to listen to "We can't push our agenda or else Republicans will push theirs the next time they get power." We know what Republicans are now, so when it's our turn, we can safely ignore them and their whining."</i><br /><br />No, never underestimate the ability of Democrats to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.Paul451https://www.blogger.com/profile/12119086761190994938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-65624012527540751262017-11-02T10:32:34.048-07:002017-11-02T10:32:34.048-07:00raito: "As for the estate tax, it pretty wel...raito: <i>"As for the estate tax, it pretty well shows that money = power. Would any other clause that affects so few people generate so much debate, were it not that those few are the ones with the money? I don't think so."</i><br /><br />Concur. The secondary reason is that by discussing the 'death tax' (aka 'the ordinary income tax' that rich people want even greater special exemptions from) makes them APPEAR to be advocating on behalf of ALL older people (even those whose estates would never trigger 'death taxes'). <br /><br />Add in the complaint that the Affordable Care Act threatens Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security and they don't have to do much to sustain a claim that they're looking after the interests of the elderly middle class.donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-41010534691128901372017-11-02T10:16:47.158-07:002017-11-02T10:16:47.158-07:00"Caller said that it was only reasonable to t..."Caller said that it was only reasonable to tax taxes, because otherwise those in high-tax states aren't paying their fair share of federal taxes."<br /><br />California is a 'donor' state, receiving a smaller amount per tax dollar from the Fed than we pay to it. ObamaCare appears to have reduced the rate at which California gets mooched (so we don't pay quite so much more than we receive, unlike under Bush) - which is one of the real reasons the Red States despise it (and us) so much...like any moocher, they despise the folks they're mooching from (and fear that the spigots may get turned off - then they'll have to wait around for their own smart people to invent smart phones and what-not...).<br /><br />http://www.politifact.com/california/article/2017/feb/14/does-california-give-more-it-gets-dc/donzelionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05991849781932619746noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-60686028044704682692017-11-02T09:29:54.834-07:002017-11-02T09:29:54.834-07:00and, again, about "Cut!Cut!Cut!":
a cha...and, again, about "Cut!Cut!Cut!":<br />a character in the novel dreams about a future where the CUT won: endless fields worked by scared apparently Neanderthals or similar sub-human slaves laboring under the eye of whip-carrying overseers..."plantation lords", really... :-)Marinonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-6431900755217116932017-11-02T09:21:30.342-07:002017-11-02T09:21:30.342-07:00"The Cut Cut Cut Act."
Being a sci-fi f..."The Cut Cut Cut Act."<br /><br />Being a sci-fi fan, I remember that in S.M. Stirling's Emberverse novels, "Cut!Cut!Cut!" is the warcry of the Church Universal and Triumphant (CUT), whose leader after the Change is Ted Kaczynski, aka Unabomber, and the Church happens to be one of the most evil villains of the series, as it became a conduit for supernatural evil eldritch horrors beyond space and time (when a CUT acolyte watches you and says " I...see...you..." you get possessed...)<br />Just sayin...Marinonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-89973444813795092642017-11-02T08:56:59.684-07:002017-11-02T08:56:59.684-07:00raito:
Caller said that it was only reasonable to...raito:<br /><i><br />Caller said that it was only reasonable to tax taxes, because otherwise those in high-tax states aren't paying their fair share of federal taxes. <br /></i><br /><br />Do we need any more evidence for a complete lack of principles? In what other context would so-called conservatives be arguing that income already lost to taxes should be taxed again? Their argument against the estate tax is that the money was already taxed as income, and that's not even true (inherited unrealized capital gains are <b>never</b> taxed, even when the beneficiary sells). But even if it was true, that's their argument.<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-36478124029452991652017-11-02T08:51:41.738-07:002017-11-02T08:51:41.738-07:00@Zepp,
I noticed that about her name as soon as s...@Zepp,<br /><br />I noticed that about her name as soon as she appeared on the scene. Granted, the "Huckabee" is no coincidence as she's the daughter or niece or something of the Mormon candidate Huckabee, but the fact that her other two names evoke other prominent politicians is eerie.LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-36827513385822612242017-11-02T08:21:19.681-07:002017-11-02T08:21:19.681-07:00"Sarah Huckabee Sanders"
Her name, aptl..."Sarah Huckabee Sanders"<br /><br />Her name, aptly enough, is a political Frankenstein's monster: An opportunistic money-grubbing hick, a leader of the trash christian right, and a socialist progressive.Zepp Jamiesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16261339498383415026noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-45045770436719307002017-11-02T08:14:09.858-07:002017-11-02T08:14:09.858-07:00LarryHart,
The tax bill came up on the local NPR ...LarryHart,<br /><br />The tax bill came up on the local NPR station. Caller said that it was only reasonable to tax taxes, because otherwise those in high-tax states aren't paying their fair share of federal taxes. Fortunately, the show's guest had the relevant figures showing that low-tax states tend to receive a lot more than they pay, so what's this about fair again? My personal take is that essentially wages in high-tax states are just a bit lower than they might be because of the taxes. Then again, I've also lived in Texas and paid no personal income tax, but high sales taxes.<br /><br />As for the estate tax, it pretty well shows that money = power. Would any other clause that affects so few people generate so much debate, were it not that those few are the ones with the money? I don't think so.raitonoreply@blogger.com