tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post4200712412327874960..comments2024-03-28T09:30:58.096-07:00Comments on CONTRARY BRIN: The Latest on Time Travel. An ironic title for news about weird S**TDavid Brinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-5329587592115081262014-02-07T16:56:44.509-08:002014-02-07T16:56:44.509-08:00Alex,
It was just a Star Wars joke.Alex,<br />It was just a Star Wars joke.Paul451https://www.blogger.com/profile/12119086761190994938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-79679607637031573662014-02-06T19:10:12.465-08:002014-02-06T19:10:12.465-08:00@Paul451
Perhaps they existed "a long time ag...@Paul451<br /><i>Perhaps they existed "a long time ago"?</i><br /><br />But then all they need is a vanilla relativistic starship to slow time and travel into the future and start the next colonization wave and empire. There should be Galactic empires all around us.Alex Tolleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01556422553154817988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-77970327519027390662014-02-06T15:36:59.771-08:002014-02-06T15:36:59.771-08:00I am fond of the idea that the past is just as flu...I am fond of the idea that the past is just as fluid as the future. If the past was morphing constantly, there is no reason we would know it: our present would be changing too.Jumperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11794110173836133321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-60366696917242350082014-02-06T15:35:02.339-08:002014-02-06T15:35:02.339-08:00A pioneer in nastiness, Joe Pyne was on the radio ...A pioneer in nastiness, Joe Pyne was on the radio and TV some time ago. Unfortunately.<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_PyneJumperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11794110173836133321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-38593975271234221692014-02-06T14:29:02.934-08:002014-02-06T14:29:02.934-08:00RE: New low-cost, high-energy batteries could be p...RE: New low-cost, high-energy batteries could be powered by rhubarb, plants<br />Perhaps we'll know they're getting somewhere when we read one or the other of these scenarios:<br /><br />1) Chinese, Saudis, Koch Nrothers buying up rhubarb farms worldwide or<br /><br />2) Mysterious plant disease decimating rhubarb harvests- cause unknown...<br /><br />Keith D. Halperinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-72216241314684323072014-02-06T13:39:54.385-08:002014-02-06T13:39:54.385-08:00@Alex Tolley:
I don't. Sorry. They way I came...@Alex Tolley:<br /><br />I don't. Sorry. They way I came to learn this was in conversations with my graduate advisor who was deeply impressed with Feynmann's talent for creative thinking. Without the discussions, I'm sure I would have missed this early work and easily missed the meaning behind it even if I had accidently tripped across the papers. Imagine going to an art museum with a talented artist who could explain some of what you were seeing. You get a very different experience that way than you would going on your own.<br /><br />The nutshell version, though, is that the wave equations permit solutions we usually don't use. It's like when we reject negative solutions to certain problems involving motion. If you want to know how long it will take before a certain collision occurs and get two answers (negative and positive) you can reject the negative one based on the fact that you want a future solution. The equation produces both, but your problem has further constraints. It is possible we have added causality as a 'further constraint' when we don't really need to. The equations certainly aren't forcing us to do it within classical field theory anyway. 8)Alfred Differnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-14067482852370848572014-02-06T10:59:59.600-08:002014-02-06T10:59:59.600-08:00Alex,
"I'm less sure about home energy st...Alex,<br /><i>"I'm less sure about home energy storage, but the possibility of energy delivery by electrolyte might be a game changer."</i><br /><br />Being able to store solar power at your home will make solar panels that much more useful. Being able to store off-peak grid-power at your home for use during peak times will dramatically improve the efficiency of the grid (reducing peakiness.) Being able to store off-peak wind and solar power at large generator sites for use during peak (or night/calm weather) makes alternative suppliers more profitable and more reliable. Being able to store power at every sub-station makes the whole grid more reliable. Being able to <i>truck</i> charged electrolyte to storm-isolated sub-stations, businesses, even homes after natural disasters is kind of cool too. [And, of course, being able to "recharge" electric cars by refueling via a bowser-pump at any service station fundamentally changes the whole "range-anxiety" thing.]<br /><br />Flow batteries are cooler than conventional (cell) batteries because it separates the "capacity" from the "supply rate". To increase the storage capacity, you only need bigger tanks, not more cells. If you can get the price of the electrolyte down, you drastically reduce storage costs for these kind of large-scale applications, <i>even if you don't reduce the cell-costs</i>. I've had my fingers crossed for flow-batteries for years.<br /><br /><i>"If time travel to the past was possible, this could mean stellar distances are not a barrier to starflight or communication."</i><br /><br />Interesting observation.<br /><br /><i>"Again where are the human galactic empires?"</i><br /><br />Perhaps they existed "a long time ago"? :)Paul451https://www.blogger.com/profile/12119086761190994938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-42749758367210304282014-02-06T09:46:06.561-08:002014-02-06T09:46:06.561-08:00geeez Mr. never-appeal-to-authority sure don't...geeez Mr. never-appeal-to-authority sure don't follow his own advice...David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-83792401484329271472014-02-05T23:31:01.882-08:002014-02-05T23:31:01.882-08:00As evidenced by our discussion of 'time travel...As evidenced by our discussion of 'time travel', many of our most treasured scientific theories rely and are based on extended metaphor (which does not necessarily imply that they are either invalid or false) but does suggest that they are exceptionally vulnerable to both misinterpretation & fallacious logic, a point that I have tried to communicate again & again, often failing miserably, especially in the cases of social policy, climate change & quantum theory. To this end, I have referenced a few important articles (listed below) which, if given the opportunity, should clarify my argument regarding the mythic irrationalities of language, society & science:<br /><br />(1) 'Position paper on metaphor,' by Lakoff, at<br />http://acl.ldc.upenn.edu/T/T87/T87-1039.pdf<br /><br />(2) ‘Metaphor in Science,’ by Hoffman, at<br />http://cmapsinternal.ihmc.us/rid%3D1197480436708_369198822_9945/Metaphor%2520in%2520Science%25201979.pdf<br /><br />(3) 'Metaphoric Fallacy to<br />a Deductive Inference', at<br />http://ojs.uwindsor.ca/ojs/leddy/index.php/informal_logic/article/view/1192/2410<br /><br />(4) ‘Metaphors we live by’, by Lakoff and Johnson, at<br />http://pages.vassar.edu/theories-of-the-novel/files/2013/04/Metaphors-We-Live-By.pdf<br />‘Metaphors we live by’, Lakoff and Johnson<br /><br /><br />Best.<br />locumranchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-54324459886496078032014-02-05T21:07:41.146-08:002014-02-05T21:07:41.146-08:00@Alfred The classical world doesn't really obj...@Alfred <i>The classical world doesn't really object to time reversal either. <br />Wheeler and Feynmann showed how a classical theory could violate causality at the detail level and not appear to do so at the larger level and didn't rely on quantum to do it.</i><br /><br />Do you have an accessible reference for this (something that doesn't require a physics degree to understand)?Alex Tolleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01556422553154817988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-52866159354403686152014-02-05T21:00:27.313-08:002014-02-05T21:00:27.313-08:00I view the difficulties of time and interstellar t...I view the difficulties of time and interstellar travel as different scales of the same hurdle. In order to do either, human beings need to last long enough, or the laws of physics need to be adjusted to allow for movement at the speeds necessary, to get where we want to go in our current lifespans.Robert Sandstedthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05578178855859243841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-13844729201482063032014-02-05T20:25:52.112-08:002014-02-05T20:25:52.112-08:00The classical world doesn't really object to t...The classical world doesn't really object to time reversal either. People get too hooked on the idea that there is an entropy issue, but I don't see it. Entropy says more about how much control you have over the microstate of a system relative to agreed upon macrostates than anything else. We make up the macrostate definitions. Nature doesn't really have to care that a bazillion different detailed arrangements of atoms in a box lead to the same pressure measurement while two bazillion states lead to a slightly different pressure. If we can't measure the details (let alone control them) we will observe the macrostates that are most likely and perceive trends. Nature doesn't have to care how we see it all.<br /><br />Wheeler and Feynmann showed how a classical theory could violate causality at the detail level and not appear to do so at the larger level and didn't rely on quantum to do it. It's just a matter of recognizing that there are other solutions to radiation equations besides the 'retarded' ones. We can use superpositions of advanced and retarded solution and the physics still works. If there is one thing I learned from quantum theory it is that when two approaches produce indistinguishable results, it is best to assume the assumptions that distinguish the theories are probably illusory. Set them aside and see if one can make sense of what is left.Alfred Differhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01170159981105973192noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-70441712996123481042014-02-05T19:36:25.180-08:002014-02-05T19:36:25.180-08:00I'm with those who consider that Hameroff and ...I'm with those who consider that Hameroff and Penrose's theory of consciousness is just so much bafflegab. If it was true, wouldn't this just delay Kurzweil's forecast timeframe of AGI?<br /><br />I don't see Deutsch as having advanced anything regarding the possibility of time travel. While the quantum world allows for time reversal, that doesn't mean that this applies at the macro level. Newer ideas that use entropy to ensure events move in one direction seem more reasonable to me. Relativity allows a form of time travel to the future, but I see nothing to really allow time travel to past, and logical paradoxes don't really cut as much more than a party trick. Looking for time travelers from the future is not unlike SETI (beings are out there, we just can't see them), but without even a veneer of plausibility. <br /><br />If time travel to the past was possible, this could mean stellar distances are not a barrier to starflight or communication. So where are the galactic empires? It would also mean that we have no future stellar future. Again where are the human galactic empires? <br /><br />Flow batteries are a fascinating energy storage technology. I think they are well suited to electric cars as the infrastructure is already in place - just replace gasoline with fresh electrolyte at the pump. I'm less sure about home energy storage, but the possibility of energy delivery by electrolyte might be a game changer. Alex Tolleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01556422553154817988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-40613757520534328252014-02-05T18:05:18.864-08:002014-02-05T18:05:18.864-08:00Thanks for the suggestion David. Order has been pl...Thanks for the suggestion David. Order has been placed.<br /><br />Oh and it's sloth not slouch : )Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09127945598591929729noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-35662174821085979142014-02-05T17:48:44.771-08:002014-02-05T17:48:44.771-08:00One of the characteristics of pseudo-science is th...One of the characteristics of pseudo-science is the appeal of thinking wouldn't it be great if that were true. I hate to see Hameroff and Penrose featured on your page because their theory has been searching for evidence for a long time (the tubule hypothesis is a decade old). If you actually look past the dressed up techo-babble, it is hard to find a "there" there. Commenters on the paper you link to are clear that this 'research' is not consistent with the scientific method. Complex fictional 'science' does not progress make.Jim H.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-61773437607219313532014-02-05T17:14:30.673-08:002014-02-05T17:14:30.673-08:00lousy slouch... you'd like my story "The ...lousy slouch... you'd like my story "The River of Time...."David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-59504519582223563652014-02-05T15:01:54.720-08:002014-02-05T15:01:54.720-08:00I was quite surprised to see the time-travel topic...I was quite surprised to see the time-travel topic. I had just popped H.G. Wells' "The Time Machine" into the DVD-player while waiting for this page to open up. <br /><br />I've never really bought into the "grandfather paradox." I've always thought of time as like a river. Rivers meander and overflow their banks, eroding new passages from the substrate. Going back to the past would not necessarily take you to your own past but a different one.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09127945598591929729noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-55649819844874590672014-02-05T14:17:09.734-08:002014-02-05T14:17:09.734-08:00This is why we keep locum around. Sure, he keeps d...This is why we keep locum around. Sure, he keeps doing the same thing... using armwave polemic to accuse others of armwave polemic. But this time he was both somewhat persuasive and very eloquent!David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-79739250458215531292014-02-05T14:16:32.154-08:002014-02-05T14:16:32.154-08:00A clever bit of detective work suggests that the a...A clever bit of detective work suggests that the asteroid Itokawa (peanut shaped rubble-pile imaged by the Hayabusa probe) is made up of two parts of distinctly different densities, the smaller part about 60% denser than the larger.<br /><br /><a href="http://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1405/" rel="nofollow">http://www.eso.org/public/news/eso1405/</a><br /><br />Most likely the result of a smooshy collision between two asteroids.Paul451https://www.blogger.com/profile/12119086761190994938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-74885583457307277532014-02-05T14:11:27.211-08:002014-02-05T14:11:27.211-08:00Thanks for dropping by Dr.Nemiroff. Your study ref...Thanks for dropping by Dr.Nemiroff. Your study reflects the kind of fun thinking and new use of Big Data that will propel the age of amateurs... and the age of empowered transparency.<br /><br />Loads of fun!David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-67744710339338532272014-02-05T13:18:00.438-08:002014-02-05T13:18:00.438-08:00Re Penrose et al.
You seem to have a much higher t...Re Penrose et al.<br />You seem to have a much higher tolerance for hand-waving and science than I.<br /><br />This is still more of "We don't understand X, and we don't understand Y, so how about I just say they are related."<br /><br />This is all based on the "measurement problem" which is not really a problem. Declaring it a problem means you have to abandon causality and relativity and make some sort of real physical explanation for how a quantum entangled particle can transmit its state instantly over arbitrary distances.Gatornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-86853368125103961792014-02-05T12:17:07.041-08:002014-02-05T12:17:07.041-08:00Thanks, Rob, for providing excellent examples of u...Thanks, Rob, for providing excellent examples of unspoken metaphorical argument masquerading as scientific empiricism:<br /><br />(1) ‘If you traveled to the past (as if time was ‘like’, comparable or identical to a material destination), (then) the past becomes the present and future (??)”.<br />(2) ‘The alternative is the theory of time as (if it were comparable to) a hologram …’. <br />(3) ‘But as we (metaphorically) travel through (time as if it approximated a) holographic illusion … we (might be) given the (conditional) perception of a one-way trip through time despite the (assumed; unconfirmed) fact everything happened at the same instant …’<br />(4) ‘We are all (like, similar, comparable or identical to) bugs frozen in amber in that one moment of time (in which we assume that everything happens simultaneously, so) you just cannot perceive of it as (if) you are (the equivalent of a bug trapped) in the amber’.<br /><br />Unfortunately, all of your subsequent conclusions (including your apparent attachment to quantum nonsense) do not follow logically as (1) time is neither a thing nor a material place, (2) the memory of an occurrence is non-identical to an actual occurrence; (3) there is no empiric evidence to suggest that time is holographic even though human memory may be; and (4) metaphorical argument is a poor logical substitute for empiricism.<br /><br /><br /><br />Best.<br />locumranchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-39263833609204480082014-02-05T10:45:32.393-08:002014-02-05T10:45:32.393-08:00Here's an oddity of a story I had been unaware...Here's an oddity of a story I had been unaware of until yesterday. <br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Back_in_the_ussaJumperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11794110173836133321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-13118386792406985492014-02-05T10:05:52.405-08:002014-02-05T10:05:52.405-08:00Why continue search for time travelers? We alread...Why continue search for time travelers? <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Titor" rel="nofollow">We already found one!</a>atomsmithnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-84092167474164627252014-02-05T09:44:13.024-08:002014-02-05T09:44:13.024-08:00One might be able to exchange a "Here & n... One might be able to exchange a "Here & now" for a different one, that was originally a "There & then", that would become your "Here & now". I suspect a traveler to our present might learn much by lurking online and downloading a wikipedia mirror, too much to be hoped that they'd misplace their iPhone 42 or galaxy S37...Tim H.noreply@blogger.com