tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post2190980048746513830..comments2024-03-18T21:52:45.757-07:00Comments on CONTRARY BRIN: Our - controversial - future in spaceDavid Brinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comBlogger89125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-48408080119140236522018-01-13T19:14:56.402-08:002018-01-13T19:14:56.402-08:00The good news, Luis, is that the presence of perch...The good news, Luis, is that the presence of perchlorates appears to eliminate the possibility of even microbial life on the surface of Mars - it's inimical to <i>all</i> organic life. If it's not present in the water, well, there's some question as to whether alien viruses would even find Terran biology compatible in the least. After all, there are a large number of viral diseases on Earth that can't even pass from other Terran life forms to human (to the best of my knowledge, no human yet has come down with parvo or tobacco mosaic virus). Viruses from non-Terrestrial sources, emerging from a completely different evolutionary process, should be no threat whatsoever, Wells' Martians notwithstanding.Jon S.https://www.blogger.com/profile/13585842845661267920noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-90150669738908366842018-01-13T15:34:25.729-08:002018-01-13T15:34:25.729-08:00Hello, it's me, again.
Jon S:
I had not though...Hello, it's me, again.<br />Jon S:<br />I had not thought of that ... Use solid fuel rockets. I suppose it is convenient, whenever possible to separate the perchlorates from all the impurities.<br />It is unfortunate that there is great contamination of perchlorates on Mars; because perchlorate reduces the production of thyroid hormone in the thyroid gland How did this happen? Did excessive radiation cause electrical storms that produced perchlorates when it rained on Mars and there was water? (rain water + chloride + electric discharge of rays = perchlorates). The evaporation of all surface water causes the remaining water to be saturated with salts and minerals.<br />I wonder if it will be enough to distill the water to rid it of all toxic substances. Anyway, we must disinfect the water perfectly. Our organisms could not defend themselves from the viruses and bacteria that exist in the caves of Mars and a few meters underground in some places on Mars. After all, we do not want a larva of Mars to grow in our brain and go out and open up to bites. It is fortunate for us that Mars has a sterile and lifeless surface. Maybe that will prevent the colonists from contracting some unstoppable virus or bacteria. But I would be very surprised if nobody ever gets sick of a Martian virus. I hope that the first colony anywhere in the solar system has a laboratory-hospital, with everything necessary to face a deadly epidemic.<br /><br />Yes. Onward<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-16791322104377079012018-01-13T15:21:12.983-08:002018-01-13T15:21:12.983-08:00onward
onward
onward<br /><br />onward<br />David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-46848820120836509312018-01-13T15:01:11.684-08:002018-01-13T15:01:11.684-08:00locumranch:
there is little or no difference bet...locumranch:<br /><br /><i><br />there is little or no difference between the two apocalypses prophesized by either the Biblical Dominionists or the CC Scientists. NO difference!! <br /></i><br /><br />I doubt that the Dominionist version can be avoided by simply leaving the planet.<br /><br /><i><br />So be afraid, be very afraid, purchase our products & give generously to the Religion-of-your-Choice or the Atheist's Interstellar Escape Fund.<br /></i><br /><br />This list might be the <b>only</b> place where space colonization is even discussed as linked to climate change. Most liberal/progressive discussions of climate change are directed toward mitigating the harm so that we can continue to live on earth. Which is a different thing, in fact the opposite thing of what you accuse us of here.<br /><br />Not sure why you've suddenly become a believer in the harm caused by climate change, but then insist only on a fantasy remedy. I get that you're attempting to ridicule us by parody, but the joke isn't working.<br /><br /><i><br />Of course, David confirms that the Left can only be trusted so far when he states that "These (deplorable) morons will not get seats" on any progressive-built lifeboat. Not a surprise though, as progressives everywhere continue to insist that there is NO room for the random confederate deplorable dissenter in any of their all-inclusive progressive utopias.<br /></i><br /><br />It's not about political dissent. There's no room for those who insist to the last minute that no lifeboats should be built and who actively block the planning and building.<br /><br />If he had said "Those grasshoppers will not get any seats on ant-built lifeboats," you'd be forced to understand.<br /><br /><i><br />We'll just have to build our own progressive-free Confederate Utopia: NO PROGS ALLOWED.<br /></i><br /><br />Would you please? And all go there already? I'm tired of waiting for the Rapture. I'll even pretend to be disappointed I can't join you if that will make it more pleasurable.<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-4726722526866364452018-01-13T14:15:56.766-08:002018-01-13T14:15:56.766-08:00VITAL (non-Brin) Weekend reading: The most recent ...VITAL (non-Brin) Weekend reading: The most recent edition of The World Post (carried on the WP site) is one of the most important ever, compiling a dozen links about how not-helpless we are, to deal with climate change. Hope can be more disturbing and demanding than "all-is-lost" nihilism! But in fact, we may be able to turn the corner on this, if our ship's tiller can be yanked out of the hands of rich morons.<br /><br />--- EXAMPLES: "From the oil belt of California’s San Joaquin Valley, Bridget Huber reports that climate policies are not killing jobs, but creating them. Through the prism of on-the-job training and apprenticeship programs of the ironworkers’ and electrical workers’ unions in Fresno, she traces the return of robust job and wage growth to what had become a depressed economic zone. This is largely thanks to state mandates to meet requirements for renewable energy production. “Solar saved our bacon,” one veteran ironworker told her. Also contributing in a major way to high-wage employment, she reports, are the construction jobs associated with California’s massive high-speed rail project running through the region.<br /><br />"Brian Barth reports from farms in eastern North Carolina where pork production giant Smithfield Foods — the largest producer of pork in the world — has rolled out efforts to reduce the carbon footprint of its meat production “According to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change,” writes Barth, “agriculture accounts for about a quarter of global greenhouse gas emissions, roughly the same as the combined total for electricity and heating, and well above the transportation sector, which contributes just 14 percent. Add emissions from refrigeration, shipping and other activities required to get your dinner from farm to plate, and the food system’s share of global greenhouse gases climbs to roughly a third, making it easily the most climate-unfriendly sector of the global economy.”<br /><br />"Barth discusses Paul Hawken’s book “Natural Capitalism,” in which the environmentalist lays out the top 100 solutions to climate change. Of these, “11 are related to food systems, seven to energy systems and none to transportation systems. Electric vehicles are #26, while ‘tree intercropping’ — planting strips of apple trees throughout a corn field, for example — is #17. The top food-related practices — reducing food waste (#3) and switching to a plant-rich diet (#4) — are largely consumer-driven solutions.” Yet Barth’s reporting suggests that farmers and producers play a crucial part in reducing emissions as well. Barth also discusses silvopasture — a “mashup of forestry and grazing” — which is the highest-ranked agricultural solution to climate change in Hawken’s analysis.<br /><br />"The challenge for all these distributed cases of climate action is how to scale them up to realize the potential for massive change as the clock ticks. The political roadblocks of vested interests which always resist change aside, what has been true throughout history is that, in the end, scale and resources follow cultural commitments. That commitment will only grow deeper if society becomes more fully aware of the whole picture of what it is already doing."<br /><br />https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/theworldpost/wp/2018/01/12/climate-action/?utm_term=.8b53e64a53c6David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-57137211516602560312018-01-13T13:20:37.560-08:002018-01-13T13:20:37.560-08:00The purpose of the GOP moon obsession is to take w...The purpose of the GOP moon obsession is to take what little space effort we have, and fritter it away in futile symbolism, and giving away all our space tech.David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-2107922962679261322018-01-13T13:19:33.480-08:002018-01-13T13:19:33.480-08:00Argh, it's like a train wreck, I cannot look a...Argh, it's like a train wreck, I cannot look away! "What I suggest is a Right & Left Cooperative Alliance to make Space Travel topical again as there is little or no difference between the two apocalypses prophesized by either the Biblical Dominionists or the CC Scientists. NO difference!! "<br /><br />No difference except for being exact and diametric opposites, in every conceivable, logical or scientific way. Except for that, then sure: "Opposite-to true, means my howl is true!!!!!!!!!"<br />David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-18984898071916951792018-01-13T13:15:50.212-08:002018-01-13T13:15:50.212-08:00https://archive.org/stream/TheMartianWay/MartianWa...<br /><br />https://archive.org/stream/TheMartianWay/MartianWayByIsaacAsimov1950s_djvu.txt<br /><br />Forget about me, read Isaac Asimov's 'The Martian Way' instead as it's prophetic on many levels, including politics & balkanisation. David may be good egg but, like most progressives, he imagines centrally planned incremental progress in the absence of discomfort, dissent, hardship or sacrifice.<br /><br />It's hard to argue with success, and CC scare-mongering has been very very successful but accomplished nothing besides encouraging the separation of paper & plastic. Pffft !!! Why not aim high if you're willing to encourage a panic to galvanise public opinion?? After all, the Red Scare got the USA to the Moon which suggests that the CC catastrophe could be used to scare humanity all the way to Saturn if properly applied.<br /><br />What I suggest is a Right & Left Cooperative Alliance to make Space Travel topical again as there is little or no difference between the two apocalypses prophesized by either the Biblical Dominionists or the CC Scientists. NO difference!! So be afraid, be very afraid, purchase our products & give generously to the Religion-of-your-Choice or the Atheist's Interstellar Escape Fund.<br /><br />Of course, David confirms that the Left can only be trusted so far when he states that "These (deplorable) morons will not get seats" on any progressive-built lifeboat. Not a surprise though, as progressives everywhere continue to insist that there is NO room for the random confederate deplorable dissenter in any of their all-inclusive progressive utopias.<br /><br />We'll just have to build our own progressive-free Confederate Utopia: NO PROGS ALLOWED.<br /><br /><br />Bestlocumranchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-48112241727921640362018-01-13T11:55:30.046-08:002018-01-13T11:55:30.046-08:00Jon S:
I for one don't mind using Star Trek a...Jon S:<br /><i><br />I for one don't mind using Star Trek as a template - except that speaking for myself, I'd just as soon avoid the Eugenics Wars, the Bell Riots, and World War Three.<br /></i><br /><br />All of those were retcons, although some were quite early ones. When "The Cage", "Where No Man Has Gone Before", "The Man Trap", etc first aired, none of them required an explanation of the steps by which the 1960s progressed into the then-unspecified future of the Enterprise. Star Trek was not written as a mystery in which the early episodes leave you wondering "How did this ever come to pass" until clues are revealed in later episodes. No, the elements of past history were established as they were needed to launch a particular story in ST's present time (Khan, for example, or the guy who invented warp drive) without regard to how they all fit together into a coherent history.<br /><br />Point being, there's no reason to insist that the path to a Trek-like future <b>requires</b> passing through the individual plot elements that were later established in the series.<br /><br />As to he-whom-I-shouldn't-read-but-sometimes-I-still-do above, I'm confused as to whether he accepts that climate change is a real thing that we must escape from, or if he sides with the Rural Red-Staters and the Republicans they support who think the whole thing is a liberal hoax.<br /><br />If CC is a real danger and we've passed the point where escape from earth is humanity's only option, then the liberals were right all along, and the ones who metaphorically rammed the iceberg that they insisted was not there are the Rural Red Staters. And in that situation, most of mankind is simply doomed, because there are no lifeboats and no place to row for if there were.<br /><br />If CC is a real danger, but there's still time to save earth as a habitat, then doing so makes a lot more sense than indulging escape fantasies. Again, the liberals are correct in everything they urge, and they must be allowed to patch and right the ship without distracting chatter about arming the imaginary lifeboats against imaginary aliens who might prevent us from prospering on their imaginary escape routes.<br /><br />If CC is not a real danger, and all of this is just a nanny-state liberal excuse for nagging us about what to do, then the iceberg itself is imaginary, so there's no point talking about who rammed it or what to do about it. The whole point is that the Rural Red-Staters are right to keep drilling for oil and burning coal so as not to freeze in the dark. In that case, the hysteria over lifeboats and aliens is really just hysteria.<br /><br />So I'm just a bit curious as to exactly which <b>way</b> your metaphor fails to make sense.<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-42209191841878260142018-01-13T11:42:11.959-08:002018-01-13T11:42:11.959-08:00Okay, back to skim-skipping locum. He's back t...Okay, back to skim-skipping locum. He's back to: "If I yowl the exact opposite to the blatant facts, that makes it true!!!! His is the cult that has always aimed us at icebergs, from tobacco, smog, ozone, racism, river-dumping, science-hating and carbon-spewing...<br /><br />... to the elimination of industrial R&D and reduction of corporate ROI (return on investment) horizons from five years to five weeks, sometimes five days. <br /><br />I mention this last one NOT to refute him -- that is futile. Screeching ""It's opposite-to-true, and therefore true, yippee!" is his cult's thing. No, his usefulness is in continuously getting me to refine my list of Things That 99% of Liberals Are Too STupid To Notice and Use As Weapons. The deliberate shortening of corporate ROI is a lobotomization that the feudalists have used to demolish the IQ of capitalism.<br /><br />But the other Opposite To True (OTT) is just hilarious! While grabbing the tiller back from raving, spittle-spewing lunatics WE are also the ones building any lifeboat capability. In parallel. These morons will not get seats.<br />David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-54029913860017085412018-01-13T11:27:55.969-08:002018-01-13T11:27:55.969-08:00Luis, what I meant about fuel at Mars is that the ...Luis, what I meant about fuel at Mars is that the perchlorate salts found in many soil samples are a crucial ingredient for modern rocket fuels. Those could potentially be refined to refuel chemical rockets (useful for planetary takeoffs and landings). The water might be undrinkable, but still useful.<br /><br />If there's ice on Deimos, it would probably be more like the ice on Europa - mostly water, probably useful both for hydrogen (and oxygen!) and for providing drinking water. But you could ship up fuel for chemical rockets from the Martian surface.<br /><br />Kit, I for one don't mind using Star Trek as a template - except that speaking for myself, I'd just as soon avoid the Eugenics Wars, the Bell Riots, and World War Three.Jon S.https://www.blogger.com/profile/13585842845661267920noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-24893356844675383312018-01-13T11:13:07.837-08:002018-01-13T11:13:07.837-08:00KF Anonymous spews progressive cant when ze(?) say...<br />KF Anonymous spews progressive cant when ze(?) says "we can all create totally different variations or concepts of civilization <b>as long as they are based on equal opportunities and respect for the rights of all human beings</b> (among other things)" which means, among other things, that we cannot "create totally different variations or concepts of civilization" unless those so-called new societies are 'just like us' & abide by our false equalism ideal that has yet to be realised by any existent human society.<br /><br />David does something similar when he reiterates the Titanic worldview as he REFUSES to build lifeboats while liberally accusing those Confederate nihilists who wish to 'abandon ship' as disloyal, treasonous & ungrateful to the 'Ship of State'.<br /><br />"The ship can still be saved", says our Union Jack draped Caption who self-identifies as a fact-person, "if you let competent hands back at the tiller", the same competent people who rammed the proverbial iceberg in the first place (??), as long as you pay no attention to the icy waters flooding the lower decks and the verifiable absence of sufficient lifeboats.<br /><br />Says Captain David, "Remain Calm, the World is Ending (because CC), but we'll get right on it after we end world hunger, perfect humanity & quadruple social spending because only cowards abandon ship, lifeboats are for losers, and we'll build some when we're good & ready, trust us".<br /><br /><br />Best<br />____<br />@Luis: Read 'The Martian Way', circa 1952, by Isaac Asimov, for an in depth analysis of colonising Mars & asteroid mining. locumranchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-32236014106572617232018-01-13T10:45:23.629-08:002018-01-13T10:45:23.629-08:00Hola. Soy yo de nuevo
It is certainly possible to ...Hola. Soy yo de nuevo<br />It is certainly possible to imagine more practical ways of colonizing Mars.<br />We need Mars, as a second reserve of the human species. (It is evident that the human species is in danger of extinction.) Thus, if the plans of the oligarchs cause a war that makes our planet uninhabitable, the colonies on Mars will suffice for humanity to restart a new history .... unless the oligarchs arrive in spaceships of escape to the colonies on Mars and reinitiate the cycle of madness.<br />But if the objective of entrepreneurs is to exploit the resources of asteroids, is not it more prudent to create a network of refueling stations and emergency shelters with supplies and nuclear reactors in those places. It is not possible to leave the problem of energy at random in places where low temperatures represent a more complex problem than in our world.<br />On one occasion, an Egyptian king sent a great army across the desert, to conquer distant lands. But they did not investigate well the problem of water supply, nor of provisions. That army was never seen again. They disappeared, buried under the sand of the hot desert.<br />Space is worse than the desert. We are talking about trips that will take years. Which raises the food; the air; the fuel and the spare parts and repair materials at the same level of importance as the water. Which makes it vital to create a network of refuges and fuel stations and supplies throughout the entire solar system. If we were astronauts on a flight to the moon Europa, and a plum-sized meteor collides with our main hydrogen fuel tank, we will be in serious trouble without a shelter at a reachable distance in a few months.<br />The army manual: FM 90-3 Appendix G "Desert Operations" It says it all clearly: The forces trying to survive in the desert without an adequate water supply have always encountered a disaster. The more important it is to have all kinds of supplies at distances difficult to imagine!<br />Of course, it is possible to use only robots and the matter is simpler. Only a money problem. But there is something that the miners of the asteroid belt have not foreseen, and it is certainly advisable that this detail is not yet mentioned. So I serve, only as an oracle. A clue: There will be a change of plans motivated by another great nation. What was insured is about to be lost. Fear multiplies expenses. Chaos and confusion. Nobody will give in The angels now carry swords.<br />Jo, jo, jo ... I'm not a prophet. Do not; it is not my intention. But everyone can know what another man plans based on his actions. For the lion will continue to eat people and the rabbit will continue eating carrots.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-67151244218849558042018-01-13T06:10:32.124-08:002018-01-13T06:10:32.124-08:00I said:
Those earthbound colonies were already ha...I said:<br /><i><br />Those earthbound colonies were already habitable by human beings.<br /></i><br /><br />Total aside, but it just occurred to me to wonder why people who get their panties in a knot over the word "inflammable" don't seem to mind or even notice that "habitable" and "inhabitable" mean the same thing.LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-77596582170291618582018-01-13T06:08:24.619-08:002018-01-13T06:08:24.619-08:00Daniel Duffy:
...colonists never intend to return...Daniel Duffy:<br /><i><br />...colonists never intend to return. That's the whole point of colonization. The pilgrims who landed at Plymouth never expect to return home to England. They were going to make a new permanent home in the New World. The pioneers travelling the Oregon trail never intended to go back East. The convicts sent to Australia weren't allowed to come back, nor were the indentured servants who avoided the gallows by being sent to Virginia.<br /><br />The first people to land on Mars will live out their lives and die on that planet - never to return to Earth.<br /></i><br /><br />Interesting point, but there's a difference. Those earthbound colonies were already habitable by human beings. Some might have had harsh conditions to overcome, but the environment didn't require industrial "Angloforming" prior to the first settlers moving in. Colonization of Mars requires a whole lot of prep work, some of which might require "the first people to land".<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-33022530597454301402018-01-13T06:00:48.247-08:002018-01-13T06:00:48.247-08:00Daniel Duffy:
Similarly, we should set up a perma...Daniel Duffy:<br /><i><br />Similarly, we should set up a permanent self sufficient science base in tunnels carved into Phobos<br /></i><br /><br />You remind me of something I haven't thought about in the twenty or so years since I read Kim Stanley Robinson's "Red Mars". In that book, a science team of some sort was having a difficult time living in the almost no-gravity conditions on Phobos. One of the scientists or engineers (I forget exactly who) suggested creating a high-speed rail car to circle the globe, creating its own pseudo-gravity inside.<br /><br />My thought at the time, which I didn't then dwell on, was that that would produce the opposite effect of that intended, making gravity inside the car <b>lighter</b>. Or were the people inside the train car meant to walk on the ceiling of the car instead? As I know there are KSR fans posting here, does anyone have a more informed take on this part of the book?<br />LarryHartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-74891820681344628242018-01-13T04:48:50.749-08:002018-01-13T04:48:50.749-08:00The "one-way=never-to return" aspect of ...The "one-way=never-to return" aspect of space colonization is an important point. We should explore with robots and probes. Colonization, by definition, involves humans.<br /><br />And while Columbus and Magellan eventually returned home after their voyages of discovery, colonists never intend to return. That's the whole point of colonization. The pilgrims who landed at Plymouth never expect to return home to England. They were going to make a new permanent home in the New World. The pioneers travelling the Oregon trail never intended to go back East. The convicts sent to Australia weren't allowed to come back, nor were the indentured servants who avoided the gallows by being sent to Virginia.<br /><br />The first people to land on Mars will live out their lives and die on that planet - never to return to Earth.DPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07087941506162882852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-31984347287824951552018-01-13T04:40:34.915-08:002018-01-13T04:40:34.915-08:00Nothing wrong with going back to the moon and esta...Nothing wrong with going back to the moon and establishing the Lunar equivalent of an Antarctic weather station (something permanent and even self-sufficient to learn how to live off the land). Only in this case the most useful thing we could do is build a giant space radio telescope on the far side of the moon.<br /><br />But we won't colonize the Moon anymore than we have colonized Antarctica.<br /><br />Similarly, we should set up a permanent self sufficient science base in tunnels carved into Phobos. From their we can explore every inch of Mars from the high ground of low orbit utilizing rovers, drones and dirigibles controlled in real time.<br /><br />As for actually landing humans on Mars, that is far more difficult.The Martian atmosphere is too thin for a parachute landing and its gravity is too heavy for rocket landing. To quote SF writer Charlie Stross:<br /><br />"Landing safely on Mars is hard. The atmosphere is too thin for aerobraking of massive payloads, but thick enough to kick up horribly unpredictable turbulence if you try and use retro-rockets. So for small payloads recent probes have used the bouncy air-bag trick ... but that involves loads of up to 20 gees on impact (not good for humans!) and maxes out at around 1000 kg of payload (or the airbags are infeasibly bulky and heavy). The big sky crane approach is promising (allows retro-rockets while avoiding the turbulence/disruption of landing site effect) but nobody's tried doing it on a payload within an order of magnitude of the size necessary for even an unfueled ascent stage capable of sending an astronaut back into orbit: an ascent stage with fuel on board would be even more massive (on the order of 40-50 tons, minimum)."<br /><br />20 gees will kill a man.<br /><br />At only 38% of Earth's gravity perhaps we can construct a space elevator anchored at Mars' equator using automated equipment controlled by humans based on Phobos.<br /><br />Or we can land automated PFC factories on Mars that will create enough super GHGs to heat up Mars and generate a sufficiently thick atmosphere (mostly CO2) that will allow for safe parachute landings. But that could take over a century to accomplish<br /><br />Or we come up with insanely more powerful and efficient rocket engines to allow for landing and take off from Mars' relatively deep gravity well.<br /><br />Or we make all Mars landings by humans one way trips.<br />DPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07087941506162882852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-44758122001861232042018-01-13T04:31:41.999-08:002018-01-13T04:31:41.999-08:00Tony - Perhaps the best historical analogy to aste...Tony - Perhaps the best historical analogy to asteroid mining is aluminum. Once more precious than gold - despite being the most common element in the Earth's crust - aluminum was costly because it was incredibly expensive to extract aluminum by electromagnetic means. Then a chemical process was developed by which alumina can be extracted from bauxite. <br /><br />Compared to 19th century prices, the cost of aluminum has been essentially demonetized - allowing it to be one of the most common metals used in industry. <br /><br />Development of cost effective asteroid mining techniques will do to every metal and material what was done to aluminum. In effect, the raw materials for building a space civilization will be demonetized. Which will allow for he construction of the energy producing mirrors and lenses that will demonetize the cost of energy.<br /><br />A space based civilization whose essential costs are basically zero.DPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07087941506162882852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-37719403274964287282018-01-13T00:32:04.406-08:002018-01-13T00:32:04.406-08:00@daniel duffy,
The real barrier to asteroid mining...@daniel duffy,<br />The real barrier to asteroid mining is the energy pit we're currently stuck in.<br />I don't think it will be developed until there is a space based economy looking for cheaper resources.Tony Fiskhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14578160528746657971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-21055227339748345222018-01-13T00:23:56.132-08:002018-01-13T00:23:56.132-08:00
In response to the accusations against the Trekki...<br />In response to the accusations against the Trekkies:<br />Actually, I am sure that Star Trek fans use the ideals of Star Trek not as a law. Rather, I think the Trekkies use Star Trek as a manual of suggestions on how to create the future human civilization. And certainly, we can all create totally different variations or concepts of civilization, as long as they are based on equal opportunities and respect for the rights of all human beings (among other things).<br />The space is huge. Each one can create a utopian civilization in each of the colonies in space.<br />Those of us who respect democracy can create a civilization based on the search for the happiness of all and the search for knowledge, and create the happiest spatial colonies of the solar system.<br />If the republicans and the Russians want to make nudist colonies, and things like that, we will not stop them. If the Republicans and Russians are happy to run around naked from one place to another, I suppose they have a right to that (as long as they do not harm the rights of others)<br />Kit Fisto.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-37089265214214816442018-01-12T21:20:37.844-08:002018-01-12T21:20:37.844-08:00Guys learn to recognize sings of "progress.&q...Guys learn to recognize sings of "progress." When finally cornered by the insanity of their delusional "side," and its betrayal of decent conservatism, some confederates rise up and decide to join the conservative wing of the Union and oppose the Foxite-ologarch-antiscience madness. Others seek refuge in false-equivalence. But locum has done something else.<br /><br />"All is lost!" And "Get those women and children out of my way, the lifeboat is mine!" Ignoring the pure fact that <br /><br />(1) the ship can still be saved, if you let competent hands back at the tiller, and<br />(2) Any lifeboats that function will be built by and run by fact-people. With memories.<br /><br />Which leaves the final refuge of nihilists. All is lost. David Brinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465315130418506525noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-25462109866339637402018-01-12T20:18:01.829-08:002018-01-12T20:18:01.829-08:00Goodnight everyone.
Goodnight everyone.<br />Winter7https://www.blogger.com/profile/16829856315044551289noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-66106054601135183252018-01-12T20:13:02.587-08:002018-01-12T20:13:02.587-08:00LarryHart:
You mentioned the movie Outland. Yes. A...LarryHart:<br />You mentioned the movie Outland. Yes. A police story located in a space colony. Undoubtedly, where humans go, they will also carry all the good and evil that humanity has. Yes ... There is no doubt that colonies in space and on other planets will have problems of criminality. Especially, in the Soviet colonies. Although, I suppose that every city governed by corrupt politicians and oligarchs is a fertile ground for the birth of all kinds of evil.<br />But humans will always have the hope, and ingenuity, to survive; even in those places where moving forward seems impossible.Winter7https://www.blogger.com/profile/16829856315044551289noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8587336.post-62829570466282388762018-01-12T20:03:53.543-08:002018-01-12T20:03:53.543-08:00Jon S:
¡True! I suppose this is the first time tha...Jon S:<br />¡True! I suppose this is the first time that NASA photographs water on the surface of Mars. (I hope it is not an image coloring trick or a Photoshop trick)<br />This is the link:<br />https://phys.org/news/2018-01-deep-glaciers-mars.html <br /><br />I believe that hydrogen hydrogen from Mars will not be used to send it to other ships. I think it will only be used for the takeoff of ships on Mars, which, once free of the gravity of Mars, could refuel at a station on the moon Deimos. And the fuel in that orbital station would be created in with ice on the moon Europa. For it is easier to raise fuel from the moon Europa, than from the surface of the planet Mars. A trailer could carry the fuel from Europe to Deimos. Deimos is so small that it can serve as part of a permanent orbital station.<br />Winter7https://www.blogger.com/profile/16829856315044551289noreply@blogger.com